Alliant shotgun powders in CF rifle cases

When they start to become more readily available again, I want to start shooting the slower Alliant shotgun powders in my .30 and .35 caliber rifles (and a .24 or .25 if I should ever find one).

Question is, of the following list, which ones have you tried and found to work well:

• Blue Dot (I've had some good experinces with this one in the '06)
• Pro Reach
• Steel
• 410

...and, how do they rate against ol' 2400?

Thanks,
MJ

It's not about gun control, it's about people control. The progressives are using terrorists and the insane to further their agenda. If the socialist news media wasn't complicit, we could sit back and watch Fast & Furious and Benghazi-gate unfold.

only one i have ever heard of and used on the list is the steel powder.
it is a bulkier less temperature sensitive blue -dot.

it's all an educated guess,,,, till the trigger is pulled.

the more i find out about shootin boolits, the more it contradicts everything i ever learned about shooting jaxketed.

I use B D at 19.2gn in my 7x57 for the 160gn bullet at 1900fps and in my 6.5 Gm with 9gn under a 123gn bullet for 1750fps and even use it in my 20 VT for a sweet little under 200 yd rabbit load where 9gn gets the 34gn Nosler bullet away at a very decent 2700fps.
21gn Red Dot gets a 350gn bullet to 1500fps and great plinking fun but have also taken a number of goats with this load.

A 7x57 and a 404, all a man needs anywhere,anytime,ever.

only one i have ever heard of and used on the list is the steel powder.
it is a bulkier less temperature sensitive blue -dot.Tell us about your experiences with Steel.

I made links to Alliant's webpages describing Pro Reach, Steel and 410 just for those who haven't yet heard of them.

MJ

It's not about gun control, it's about people control. The progressives are using terrorists and the insane to further their agenda. If the socialist news media wasn't complicit, we could sit back and watch Fast & Furious and Benghazi-gate unfold.

i have only used it in the 44 mag 45 colt and the 30-06.
it just shoots like anything else.
nothing weird or spectacular it doesn't meter worth a darn.
it makes some sweet steel shot loads though.

it's all an educated guess,,,, till the trigger is pulled.

the more i find out about shootin boolits, the more it contradicts everything i ever learned about shooting jaxketed.

I use the steel in the 30-30 for plinker and CBA postal matches, also buckshot, slug, squirrel, and turkey loads. I bought 5lbs of it a while back because I thought I was going to get back into duck hunting. I ran out of 2400 while testing and never restocked on it (darn), because it did well in the 30-30. So I tried the steel. In my experience, trying to come close with a load with burn rate charts it seems to be a bit faster than the 2400 in reality from what the burn rate charts imply. To where as I have got close to 1" groups at times with about 19 gr of 2400, I could only put about 14 gr of steel in the 30-30 94, (think). In my opinion it has to be weighed or dipped. I don't know what your expectations are but here is only one example. There is really not a whole lot of data for it in cartridge cases though. I think I have been having lube problems in low vel loads and WW alloy castings, but that is another matter.

Blue Dot and Green Dot in the 223 are great all the way from 22M levels to full house. DO NOT DOUBLE CHARGE . See Accurate Reloading Forum data lists for more. Simply amazing!

BvT

Basically, I'm looking for an Alliant 2400 backup/alternative without going to 4759 (the latter of which, I have plenty).

Right now I'm using WC-820 in my 358W which is working pretty well (also works in the .350RM!) but every now and again I get a clinker over the chronograph that makes me think there's probably a better substitute available; therefore, my interest in shotgun powders which should work better at 20K PSI and under. I don't recall using much 820 in the '06 but it has proven to be a good choice in the 30-30 at 1600-1700 fps. I think GD, RD and Unique are a little fast burning for my intended use which is .25-.35 caliber hunting weight boolits (PB and GC) at 1300+ fps. I like the idea of Alliant 410 which is a flake powder designed for the .410 shotgun.

MJ

It's not about gun control, it's about people control. The progressives are using terrorists and the insane to further their agenda. If the socialist news media wasn't complicit, we could sit back and watch Fast & Furious and Benghazi-gate unfold.

I too use Alliant Steel as a replacement for 2400. Its close to the same burn rate but is a flake powder so the same weight charge better fills the case to a higher density.
I have been using it in 211 FB, 22/250, 6x45, 6mm Rem, 308 Win, and 30/06.
I have been doing a lot of rather long range shooting to 550 yards with a 308 loaded with 20gn Steel and a 200gn NEI DD boolit. It clocks just under 2000 fps and has given groups of less than MOA at 100 yards. Average extreme spread was 16 fps. It holds pretty consistently at about 2 MOA to the longest ranges I have been shooting, 550 yards. At that range it is no big deal to keep a bowling ball moving if the wind will cooperate and a bowling ball is maybe about 1.5 MOA at that range.
The only draw back is that Steel does not meter well but 2400 will. I shoot weighed charges of Steel but the results seem worth it.

I was wondering about the 410 but for me it was for use in 44Mag and 45Colt. Another thread used 20/28 and found it almost identical to Unique. Email to Alliant confirmed the burn rate similar so that seemed like a good swap to me.

Bullshop,

That sounds pretty good to me.

The ease of metering attribute is something I can live without. If I need to put ammo together quickly (by saving powder handling time) I always use #9 anyway.

Thanks,
MJ

It's not about gun control, it's about people control. The progressives are using terrorists and the insane to further their agenda. If the socialist news media wasn't complicit, we could sit back and watch Fast & Furious and Benghazi-gate unfold.

I was wondering about the 410 but for me it was for use in 44Mag and 45Colt. Another thread used 20/28 and found it almost identical to Unique. Email to Alliant confirmed the burn rate similar so that seemed like a good swap to me.2028 might be good too but for now it sounds a little fast burning... unfortunately, I can't try 'em all.

410 is interesting but I've heard some "rumors?" contradicting Alliant's claim of "Consistent performance in any weather".

MJ

It's not about gun control, it's about people control. The progressives are using terrorists and the insane to further their agenda. If the socialist news media wasn't complicit, we could sit back and watch Fast & Furious and Benghazi-gate unfold.

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Abbreviations used in Reloading
Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt"

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Comparing powders need advice..

Hello all,

I am new here and have been surfing the site and trying to get a grasp of casting. My goal is to work up a load for a lee mold 155 gr .312. I will be gas checking and sizing down to .309 with 45/45/10 tumble lube. The round will be for punching paper and if I make it out hunting deer. Rifles are savage model 16 and ptr91 (roller lock action). My question is I was comparing burn rates and found that RL7 is rated @ 93 on the chart, 4895 is @ 110, and the powder I have a huge amount of H322 is @ 100 on the chart provided by The Reload Bench. The Hodgon site list RL7 @ 70 , H322 @ 74 and 4895 @ 89. Making all 3 mid to fast range burning powders, considering H322 is smack in the middle is it safe to use and what would be a good starting load. Rl7 and 4895 from what I have read perform amazing with cast boolits in 308 win. Also would it be ok to use a jacketed bullets starting load as long as I dont seat deeper then recommend for the jacketed bullet and dont use data past 2000-2200 fps. I really would appreciate some help I have been searching and reading and I know most would say just go get the powder that you have data for but my budget doesnt allow me to do so, and living in NY components are very hard to come by. I hope no one thinks I want to be held by the hand just want to do it right and safe.

Thanks again Mike

Last edited by RAMERY; 03-08-2013 at 07:51 AM.

?Don?t carry a gun. It?s nice to have them close by, but don?t carry them. You might get arrested.? (NY )

Come on guys I have been trying to get an answer for days now and get no real response is my question that silly. I dont know whats going on but I was told this was the place to hang out with good people with knowledge on casting. If i am going about this wrong let me know please. This would be about my 2nd thread asking the same question and nothing. Thanks again Mike

?Don?t carry a gun. It?s nice to have them close by, but don?t carry them. You might get arrested.? (NY )

Not real sure but I would take a starting load for jacketed bullets of the same wieght and reduce by 10 % and work up.
Just look for pressure signs. Measuring the base of the case is good. You might shoot some factory rounds and see how much they expand in your gun.

Powder burn rates will have a direct relationship to case volume.
A burn rate suited to a 300 BO will most likely not be well suited to a 30/06 and visa versa.
You never mentioned what cartridge you are loading so maybe you didnt get an answer because you didnt finish the question, what cartridge?

It would be for 308 Win. bullshop

?Don?t carry a gun. It?s nice to have them close by, but don?t carry them. You might get arrested.? (NY )

Looking at the Hodgdon site, a 150 gr bullet has a starting load of 37gr @2500fps. To drop down to 2000-2200fps, I would think somewhere around 32-33gr would be getting close to that speed.

Take a look at the Hodgdon site to get an idea of what you want.

Looking at the Hodgdon site, a 150 gr bullet has a starting load of 37gr @2500fps. To drop down to 2000-2200fps, I would think somewhere around 32-33gr would be getting close to that speed.

Take a look at the Hodgdon site to get an idea of what you want.

Thank you for the response will give this a try, How fast can I push a cast bullet before it becomes unsafe using a gas check? Well let me rephrase that what is the suggest max before paper patching is needed as far as fps.

Last edited by RAMERY; 03-08-2013 at 04:26 PM.

?Don?t carry a gun. It?s nice to have them close by, but don?t carry them. You might get arrested.? (NY )

There is really no way to say what level your cast will be able to be pushed to. To many variables. You will have to work them out for your gun- bullets- powder.

Boolit Master Join DateMar 2007Posts256

My limited experience would be to try a slightly fatter bullet maybe 0.310-311" and try to stay under 2,000 fps for the first loads. Most mid range powders start loads in the mid 20 grain range for that velocity.

Dave

In the RCBS Cast bullet manual they list 26 gn.H 332 @ 1566 fps & 28 gn. @ 1723 with their 180 SP. In a 308. So start with 26.0 and work your way up.
A +1 on going up in sizing to .310 or .311

IHMSA # 566 "time sure flies when you're having FUN"

I actually have a .311 sizer so thats a go and thank you gentlemen so much. I am a happy man now I know where to start.

?Don?t carry a gun. It?s nice to have them close by, but don?t carry them. You might get arrested.? (NY )

Boolit Master Join DateMar 2007Posts256

See here:

http://www.castbulletassoc.org/forum/view_topic.php?id=2573&forum_id=52&highlight=h322

Scroll down for the Ed Harris post on the 30-06, cut the 308 down a touch or not as the case may be.

Dave

I cant seem to access it I found his name clicked on it but it askes me to log in.

?Don?t carry a gun. It?s nice to have them close by, but don?t carry them. You might get arrested.? (NY )

I just finished casting my first boolits awesome... Had a few wrinkled but once I got pot to right temp smooth sailing. cant wait to load some up and go to the range. Thanks again to everyone here for there help.. Will be sizing to .311 and starting @ 26 gr H322 Will let you gentlemen know how it goes.

Mike

?Don?t carry a gun. It?s nice to have them close by, but don?t carry them. You might get arrested.? (NY )

Question what seating depth would you guys recommend I loaded 10 rds saw in my lyman 49th that with a 160gr they suggested 2.635". I sat at 2.625" at this depth the gas check is at the end of the neck and begining of shoulder, no lube grooves exposed and lite crimp. Bolt closes snug as well, my boolits drop at 158.5-159 grs is this ok?

So it looks like this:
Coal-2.625"
H322-26 gr & 26.5 gr (working up load)
Lee 312-155 bullet mould
Boolits drop at-158.5-159
sized and gas checked-.311
45/45/10 lube
Remington large rifle primer
Federal once fired trim-2.003"
lee neck expander
lite crimp
alloy- ww (clip on)
water quenched

Last edited by RAMERY; 03-09-2013 at 06:42 PM.

?Don?t carry a gun. It?s nice to have them close by, but don?t carry them. You might get arrested.? (NY )

When working up a load with boolits I always start with the leading edge of the lead drive band showing some engraving on a chamberd round.

How many reloading manuals do you have? Pardon my assumptions but your question suggests that you are trying to find a powder/load from powder burn rate tables. NEVER do this. Always have specific, tested load information available. If you don't have them I would strongly suggest the Lyman Cast Bullet manual and the Lyman reloading manual. A bullet company manual such as Sierra is also very helpful.

Remember that a jacketed bullet has more resistance in the bore than any lead boolit. This means you can use jacketed data, starting at the lowest level of loads, with lead boolits.

Wayne the Shrink

There is no 'right' that requires me to work for you or you to work for me!

You may not post new threadsYou may not post repliesYou may not post attachmentsYou may not edit your postsForum Rules

Abbreviations used in Reloading
Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt"

View the original article here