To me, that is match shooting, or a prayer for hunting. No way I would take the shot while hunting. That means(again to me) that I didn't "Hunt" very well, and couldn't get close enough to take a reasonable shot.
Not a condescending statement to others, just my take on things.
Read the full article here...
Read the full article here...
Friends,As some of you know, I'm a southpaw, who is headed to Africa in the late summer of 2015
AND
that I was planning to have a LH .375 Whelen Improved rifle BUILT for the trip
BUT
I evidently am about to "fall heir to" a CZ .375 H&H Left-hand rifle in NRA Excellent Plus condition, at an absolute bargain.
(The current owner bought the CZ "on a whim" & says that he cannot "handle the recoil", so he's offered it to me for cash.)
SO
I'm wondering if anyone would like to share their PET LOAD(s) for cast boolits for the big H&H & preferably one that doesn't require Dacron/corn meal/etc in the case.THANKS for reading this.
yours, tn46
I was thinking that if I filled the hollow point with epoxy it would give me more penetration for hog hunting. I have killed plenty of hogs in the past with the bullet the way it is, but I get quite a few "Two for one" shots.
Is this something that is "SAFE" to do?
My gun is a Marlin 1895GBL lever action.
Thanks for your help guys!
Speaking of moose, supposedly the best place (best chances and price) is Newfoundland. Their moose are smaller and don't have big racks but there are lots of them and hunts are much more affordable.
If you want a "Southern" experience, try one of the south GA quail plantations. They treat you like a king.
My question is, I am considering hunting with these this fall and am somewhat unsure if that is wise or not. They are round nose, so I think it would basically be poking a hole in whatever it hits, though the MV is 2350 fps, so it does have some decent energy.
I have other bullets to hunt with, I just wanted to try something different this year and wanted to hear from the experts. 
Edit: intended game is Eastern NC whitetails.
__________________
Boolit Mold Join DateMay 2013Posts6
I took a 275 pound 8 point that was devistating my apple trees with a 55 gr out of a 22-250 w 1 shot that took out both lungs, and i know that the man, now deceased, who wrote life in the eveglades book killed the first ever game warden that was sent to the everglades with 1 shot from a 22 mag lever gun. 22 caliber is deadly imo
Boolit Master Join DateJan 2007Posts650many comments here are in conflict with many on THIS thread
I am ONLY responsible for what I Say!
I am NOT responsible for what You THINK I Said!
====
If numbers killed I'd hunt with a Calculator!
I'd not risk .223 cast on deer. FPE aside, I've dressed too many deer with 22 caliber bullets lodged in ribs, shoulders, spine, etc... Plenty were the right shot with the wrong bullet. IF I was hunting deer with .223 it be with either 75gr barnes or maybe the 90gr Sierra and as close to max as I could get without loosing decent accuracy. Read the .243 cast deer hunting thread, folks are iffy about that. The best thing .223 has going for it is velocity. Personally I like .30's, cast or jacketed and handguns 45, is all I really consider.
I support your right to keep and arm bears.
Boolit Master Join DateJan 2007Posts650many comments here are in conflict with many on THIS threadI am ONLY responsible for what I Say!
I am NOT responsible for what You THINK I Said!
Boolit Master Join DateJan 2007Posts650I'd not risk .223 cast on deer. FPE aside, I've dressed too many deer with 22 caliber bullets lodged in ribs, shoulders, spine, etc... Plenty were the right shot with the wrong bullet. IF I was hunting deer with .223 it be with either 75gr barnes or maybe the 90gr Sierra and as close to max as I could get without loosing decent accuracy. Read the .243 cast deer hunting thread, folks are iffy about that. The best thing .223 has going for it is velocity. Personally I like .30's, cast or jacketed and handguns 45, is all I really consider.I've scrubbed this whole idea of hunting with cast bullets in the .223 due to a number of factors, not the least of which was when I was able to calculate what my momentum values might be, they were as follows
grains 55
speed 2200
KE 590.964591
Momentum 0.537240537
momentum_1 5.372405372
Actually it has been my experience that a223 is no where near the killer that the 222 is. I contribute that to the lower velocity of the triple duece which allows the bullet to hold together for far more penetration. I must say that my experience in either caliber has only been with conventional jacketed bullets.
I have taken two grown red stags with the 222 in Oz using factory Remington ammo with great effect. Two stags, two shots ,both tight behind the shoulder through the lungs. Both bullets were recovered under the hide on the off side looking like little nosler adverts.
Hit ribs in and out on both to no matter,neither stag went 20 yards. I was freekn impressed to say the least. Would I have used it if I had a good 06 on hand? Well hell no,, but it was what the bloke handed me so we made it work.
When you have God in your life and a gun in your hand you are a force for good to be reckoned with.When in doubt just say thanks.
Boolit Master Join DateJan 2007Posts650The gentleman that I went hunting with has taken a number of goats and a couple of sheep with the .223 and gave me some bullets that he used in his harvests... Jim Burnworth of Western Extreme has taken the 22-250 himself and came to Lanai on a sheep hunt and nailed a fairly nice mouflon with his 22-250 to which he seems to gravitating towards on the basis of the "challenge".If I was into "reloading" I might actually try to load this for hunting except I'm a muzzleloader hunter and like my .410's, my .451's and love my 58's.. I'm just getting into flintlock .54s of which I now have two, but big bullets have no equal..
... in my humble opinion....
I am sure that you are familiar with Loni and Bill on the kapapala are you not? And the Galimba's. Kenny Miranda or Freddy Rice. I know that a lot of hunters on the BI have issues with ranchers, how are the current working conditions? I have hunted a lot there with gun and bow. Once I even sunk into the middle of a herd of wild pipi and punched a cows ticker with my recurve. Probably as exciting an event as I have ever had hunting and I have been in the thick of it many times.
When you have God in your life and a gun in your hand you are a force for good to be reckoned with.When in doubt just say thanks.
Boolit Master Join DateAug 2009Posts726Actually it has been my experience that a223 is no where near the killer that the 222 is. I contribute that to the lower velocity of the triple duece which allows the bullet to hold together for far more penetration. I must say that my experience in either caliber has only been with conventional jacketed bullets.
I have taken two grown red stags with the 222 in Oz using factory Remington ammo with great effect. Two stags, two shots ,both tight behind the shoulder through the lungs. Both bullets were recovered under the hide on the off side looking like little nosler adverts.
Hit ribs in and out on both to no matter,neither stag went 20 yards. I was freekn impressed to say the least. Would I have used it if I had a good 06 on hand? Well hell no,, but it was what the bloke handed me so we made it work.I guess all you have to do when you hunt with a .223 then is shoot the game twenty yards farther out than you do with your .222. Then it will have the same mojo.
Twenty yards.. hmm I will just have to take your word for it then, seems like a lot of fps diff to bleed off that fast but if you say so. What I do know is that I shot one stag at about 30 steps, and one at about 150 and got the same perf on both. Have not had the same experience with bullets hanging together like that in the 223. Your milage may vary obviously
When you have God in your life and a gun in your hand you are a force for good to be reckoned with.When in doubt just say thanks.
Boolit Bub Join DateAug 2012Locationnortheast ohioPosts31Twenty yards.. hmm I will just have to take your word for it then, seems like a lot of fps diff to bleed off that fast but if you say so. What I do know is that I shot one stag at about 30 steps, and one at about 150 and got the same perf on both. Have not had the same experience with bullets hanging together like that in the 223. Your milage may vary obviously300S in regards to the 222 versus 223 commint it seems to me you were using nosler partitions is that correct ?? the reason I ask is that I have used the partition on more then a few occasions with my 223, but never shot a 222. I do not recall every having one fail, but I sure as hell have not seen everything in this world and do not in anyway claim to be an expert.now based on my little knowledge I would think that if someone got the correct lead mixture, that a 224 size bullet would behave very similar to larger cast bullet, and mushroom out without losing much weight. you have no jacket controlling expansion , but that can be both good and bad.
I know you were not the one asking but I kinda just kept babbling on sorry.
No worries, actually they were just common cup and core bullets which is what really impressed me. I know that there is only approx 200 or so fps diff between the two calibers but I have yet to recover a bullet in that shape from any critter shot with a 223. Just fragments of jacket and core. I have to admit tho I have never shot partitions or Barnes or any other super premium bullets in these varmint calibers. And all of the larger game I have shot with a 22 cal have been in situations like mentioned. I have never went after anything but hogs deliberately with a varmint cal, except vermin of course.
When you have God in your life and a gun in your hand you are a force for good to be reckoned with.When in doubt just say thanks.
I knew Gordon well , good man. Lani and BilI are good folks also. I have hunted the kapapala many times shot a great mouflon there. And yes those are the galimbas I am talking about.
When you have God in your life and a gun in your hand you are a force for good to be reckoned with.When in doubt just say thanks.
Boolit Master Join DateJan 2007Posts650I knew Gordon well , good man. Lani and BilI are good folks also. I have hunted the kapapala many times shot a great mouflon there. And yes those are the galimbas I am talking about.I've hunted birds lower down on the ranch before and didn't get a chance to actually head up towards Ainapo till a couple of weeks ago... lovely lovely country up there.. looking forward to more hunts there now... being that the only place pretty much of state land that actually has game on it...You may not post new threadsYou may not post repliesYou may not post attachmentsYou may not edit your postsForum RulesKau is a special place on the Island for its lifestyle... Hope it is slow to change...
Aloha..
Abbreviations used in Reloading
Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt"
Boolit Mold Join DateOct 2008Posts18
Hi Guys
Last year for his 12th birthday I bought my son a 32-20 as his first gun . Its a savage 23c . We have just returned from the farm after a few days off for the school holidays . We hunt in the afternoon and during the day to get his eye in I spend about a hour with the motor bike and set up rabbit targets and balloons . All set up in random places all over the property, he has to find a rest or shoot free hand . I find this better than a bench type of setup as we will be hunting not target shooting. It has shown him the value of a good rest but also the concept that game will not always wait for you to find one.We ended up shooting off over 150x 115gr cast bullets sparked off by 3gr of trail boss and walking miles and miles away from tv and play station . He got his eye in and pulled off a few good free hand shots.
On our last day of hunting the rabbits where not standing still long enough for him to get a shot off , so I had the rifle and with in minutes a bunny propped @ about 40 m away I did exactly what I told my son not to do and we both learn a lesson . The shot cleaned missed. " And that's why you don't rush the shot" I told him.
We still had about 45mins of light left so we kept on walking . The sun had dropped to the tree line when we heard some sounds to the left of us my son new that this was different and said one word " pig" , he handed me the rifle and said "what do you want me to do". I put my finger to my lips and the other to my ears and we stoped and listened as the sound moved parallel to us. We matched the sound in speed and both the pig and us reached a small clearing at the same time , The pig had no idea we where there . I raised the gun to fire and my son said "take your time " which I did . The 85gr xtp @ 1950 fps struck he pig top of shoulder and going on and smashing the spine. I was dead as it hit the ground. We where so excited and with the adrenalin we dragged the pig for 15 mins where I radioed my wife to pick us up and bring a camera. Unfortunately the night time pic was not very good so the pic is the next morning.
I know that the XTP is dirty word on a cast bullet site but I am going to cast up shortly. I would like to keep the fast speed of the jacketed bullet for hunting. Bullet weight 100 gr to 115gr and hollow point for hunting.The question I keep asking my self is will the hard cast hollow point going to mushroom or splinter at 32-20 velocity . I would like to use the same bullet for plinking and hunting. The only difference between the two is the speed and gas check. The only other idea I had was giving this company my hollow points for coating rather than gas checkinghttp://www.hrbc.com.au/ I would appreciated you comments
Regards
Boolit Buddy Join DateFeb 2013LocationEastern, NCPosts66Sorry I don't know the answer as to whether it will splinter or not. Still a good story, kudos for getting your son out in wild to do some practice and some hunting.
Learning is a process, for me it usually starts bass akwards.
My favorite small to medium game load for .308 is pretty close to the old HV 32/20 load. A Lee 113gr flat point slug over 16.1gr unique for 2100fps. I cast from WW/pure + tin, 60/40 respectively with 2 or 3% tin. I've even taken a few deer with this load (target of opportunity hunting 'yotes during holiday bonus antlerless season) so don't think that 32/20 is any slouch. It's not a 500yd "lightning bolt killer" round, but if you'll teach that boy to pick his shots with care and actually hunt within the capabilities of himself and his equipment, he's going to have a bunch of great memories ahead of him.
An old Cherokee was teaching his grandson about life. "Inside me two wolves fight," he told the boy.
"One is evil - he is anger, envy, greed, arrogance, self-pity, resentment, lies, false pride, and ego. The other is good - he is joy, love, hope, serenity, humility, kindness, generosity, truth and faith. The same fight is inside you - and every other person, too."
The grandson thought for a minute and asked,"Which wolf will win?"
The old Cherokee replied, "The one you feed."
Boolit Master Join DateDec 2009LocationQuilcene, WashingtonPosts927As said above, I also use the Lee 113 gr boolit and over the years it has become one of my favorite small to medium game (up to 100#) boolits from my Contender pistol 32/20. My load (9.4 gr of 2400) gives a velocity of 1450 and in wet phone books at 40 yards penetrates 16+ inches with moderately soft lead that expands nicely. Using the Speer jacketed hollow point bullet of similar size in the same test, penetration was 10-11 inches.
Any of the GC'd 110 - 120 gr cast bullets of .311 - .314 will do very nicely in FN or RN when pushed to 1800+ fps or so, especially if slightly HP'd with the 1/8" Forster HP tool. No, they won't "splinter" with that alloy if the HP is kept at 1/8" or less. I've shot several medium sized game animals with such from a .30 carbine using the identical bullets and close to the same alloy at the same fps. Terminal results were excellent.Excellent time, hunt and fun shooting with your son........you are to be envied.
Larry Gibson
boca, first off, great job for hunting with your son. Second off, the 32-20 is an awesome little cartridge and teaching tool for young shooters. 311008 is a great mould for a very good plain base boolit that will do everything needed from a 32-20. If one wants to go with even higher velocities pick one of the gc,d versions and load with magnum pistol powders ( 2400, H-110, AA#9) type. Very versatile cartridge. JWYou may not post new threadsYou may not post repliesYou may not post attachmentsYou may not edit your postsForum Rules
Abbreviations used in Reloading
Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt"
Boolit Mold Join DateApr 2013Posts15
Curious as to who switched over to using only cast boolits for hunting and what caliber?
Boolit Bub Join DateMar 2013Posts48For handgun hunting big game I currently only use one caliber .44 mag/ special. I have been using only cast for a few years. It started by accident, went to hunt hogs and grabbed 2 boxes of shells which were supposed to be .270 gr Speer golddots. Over a heavy dose of h-110. They turned out to be 265 grain gas checked cast also over h-110. Long story short, hogs died. Good accuracy good penetration and nastry wound channels. I've been sold since. Deer and pigs so far but all have died real quick like.
Not exactly. A J-word rifle or two generally goes along these days but the CB rifles get most of the action. I've only been hunting w/ CB's for a couple of years but I can see a day when I either convert all my hunting rifles to CB's or simply leave them at home.
Life Member NRA, TSRA
Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call Lonesome Dove
Some of my favorite recipes start out with a handful of used wheelweights.
Boolit Mold Join DateDec 2012Posts18I have never killed an animal with a jacketed bullet, and very few with smokeless powder. My friends and I have hunted with cast bullets for forty years and have taken a LOT of game, both here and in Africa. The cast bullet loaded correctly is an awesome killer on anything you care to shoot. I shoot a Sharps loaded with cast bullets, usually paper patched, over black powder and use buckhorn barrel sights that come on a Sharps. Buffalo, elk, kudu, wildebeast on down, the Sharps and lead bullets gives complete penetration and a quick kill. I use cast bullets and black powder because IT WORKS.
started about 4 -5 yrs ago trying cast occasionally. Then decided to go all the time with cast for the distance and the shots I take cast is an easy choice. I like my 30 cal and my 35 cal and my 44 cal for cast boolit hunting.
Yesterday I was thinking about starting a thread to list all the game you have taken with cast. My list got so long it made me tired and I fell asleap. My nap seemed to have killed my train of thought. It dont take much any more. I still remember meal time though.
I will still use both. I have over 1K jword hunting bullets and a lot of loads for them.
[The Montana Gianni] Front sight and squeezeYou may not post new threadsYou may not post repliesYou may not post attachmentsYou may not edit your postsForum Rules
Abbreviations used in Reloading
Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt"
Boolit Mold Join DateApr 2013Posts13
Has anyone used a 243 lead cast boolit with success on deer size game? If so, what velocities are you running and what ranges have you taken them??
Even with jacketed bullets, I find the 6mm caliber lacking for large game. I've had a 6mm Ackley Improved since the early days of Ruger bolt action rifles, Sometimes it kills deer like the hammer of thor, other times it fails to reach the target. Bullet selection is critical. With cast at like half the energy, I'd compare it with a 25-20 with a strong edge for the 25-20. I.E. will kill deer, but marginal.
We need somebody/something to keep the government (cops and bureaucrats too) HONEST (by non government oversight).Every "freedom" (latitude) given to government is a loophole in the rule of law. Every loophole in the rule of law is another hole in our freedom. When they even obey the law that is. Too often government seems to feel itself above the law.
We forgot to take out the trash in 2012
Boolit Mold Join DateApr 2013Posts13Even with jacketed bullets, I find the 6mm caliber lacking for large game. I've had a 6mm Ackley Improved since the early days of Ruger bolt action rifles, Sometimes it kills deer like the hammer of thor, other times it fails to reach the target. Bullet selection is critical. With cast at like half the energy, I'd compare it with a 25-20 with a strong edge for the 25-20. I.E. will kill deer, but marginal.My main reason to cast for the 243 is Predator hunting. I have had very good luck with the 243 on deer size game. Havent had one yet go 30 yards from where it was shot. I am casting 95 grain boolits and hope to push them around 1800fps. If I stick to 100 yards or under with well placed shots i think it will do the trick.
On our small deer (90 lbs live wt.), I think you would be ok. You seem to have a good grip on range limitations and placement, so that is good. I know I will get some fire over this, but even fast 25 calibers have let me down on deer. I limit myself and my family to .264 or larger for game. I know it has been done with smaller, but it is just too unreliable. A 30 cal and no tracking, or a 22 cal and possibly a lost deer or a whole lot of work..... Not flaming you for your choice to try the 243 cal, just giving my opinion.
I came into this world kicking, screaming, and covered in someone elses blood. I plan to go out the same way.
i'll throw my opinion in too.
I have no basis to go by really, just what I have seen from shooting stuff.
the 7mm is the smallest I would use on deer, and there you have to take care
to really get things matched up.
soft noses and malleability are pertinent.
i'd really stick to jaxketed in the 243, i'm not even sold on those in the smaller calibers either.
I have used the 25's on deer a time or two and i'm not quite giving up on them yet.
[[I got the biggest buck I have ever shot with a 257 and wasn't impressed with the bullets performance]]
yeah it died ,blah, blah.
the one before that dropped like a rock and rolled down a hill, then got up and run away without leaving a drop of blood behind.
spent over 4 hrs trailing it and never seen the deer or sign it had been hit.anyway the 243 and cast for deer was the question.
I wouldn't do it... as a plain naked boolit.
p/p would be a different question.
it's all an educated guess,,,, till the trigger is pulled.the more i find out about shootin boolits, the more it contradicts everything i ever learned about shooting jaxketed.
Hmmm.... I have a question. Just where are you small caliber guys shooting those deer? I've seen lots of deer at check stations (out of state ones at that) with lots of people using small caliber rifles. Most all of these deer were shot where the bullet or boolit did the most good. Can you guess where that was?.................
45 2.1Knowledge without understanding is a dangerous thing. For a little knowledge entices us to walk its path, a bit more provides the foundation on which we take our stand, and a sufficient amount can erect a wall of knowledge around us, trapping us in our own ignorance.
Never sleep, never die
Knowledge is easy to get, but worthless if you never use it. However the info is free, so the only person you have to blame is yourself if you chose not to use the information.
Boolit Bub Join DateMar 2013Posts46Maybe I'm strang or just dumd but in my experience the .243 has killed well outside its weight class. Deer pigs elk and black bear. I've seen them all drop with one well placed shot. Neck on the elk boiler room on the rest. These are from two diffrent hunters both good riflemen and I witnessed the shots and the games reaction. Upon field dressing said game I was decent penetration and good wound channels and heavy blood loss. The elk was shot with jword bullets the rest cast with gas check. One of these men uses his bolt .243 for everything. Because its light accurate he shoots it well and has not lost an animal or had to look very to find them.
Every deer I have ever seen that was shot with a 6mm/243 just plain died (jwords). ACCURACY/SHOT PLACEMENT and I am talking 150 to 200 lb whitetails.A bowling ball at 3,000 fps will not work if you only hit it in the hoof.
I intend to kill a buck with a gaschecked flatnosed castboolit in a .243 Model 70 SA-LW @ 2800+ fps, just has not happened yet....I have no reservations about what I am doing. Cliff notes version of the story..........= I will do my part and the deer will die.
"Happiness is a target rich environment"
All the hunters I know personally have always shot deer with 243, 270 and a few diehards with the 06. I know of no one who used a 30WCF case or similar, but a lot of folks I know well have them sitting in closets. ... felixYou may not post new threadsYou may not post repliesYou may not post attachmentsYou may not edit your postsForum Rules
Abbreviations used in Reloading
Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt"
Boolit Mold Join DateFeb 2013Posts4
My question about BP .45 colt is,is this enough for hunting deer? I hunt with a Blackhawk now and use hot loads that I add a bit of red paint to so I don't feed them to my colt repro's. It would be great to have one load that will work in both the BH and the colts. The load I am looking at using is a Lyman 452-664 lubed with Emmerits, cast from 20 to 1 in a Starline case primed with a federal 150. I dropped 40 grains of KIK 3F in a volume measure and got a average weight of 37.2 grs. This is giving me about 1/16 of an inch compression on my powder. At this point I am loading up 50 for range testing just to see how they shoot. I hunt in heavy cover and a 7 to 10 yard shot is about all I get here in the Pennsylvania thorn rose paradise I call SGL 91. Any advice from you experienced smokewagon hunters would be much appreciated. Thank you.Holeinhide.
a 250 at @ 900 fps with a flat point and semi-soft alloy.
within 25 yds distance.
i'd say you have no problem.
the original 45 colt with a 250 [and approx. 40 grs black powder] at that same velocity was specced to take down a horse.
the 664 has a lot more meplat than the original 45 colt boolit.
it's all an educated guess,,,, till the trigger is pulled.the more i find out about shootin boolits, the more it contradicts everything i ever learned about shooting jaxketed.
I believe it was in "Sixguns" that Elmer Keith told of a cowboy shooting a grizzly through the head with a 45 Colt loaded with black powder that easily killed the bear . I would think it would take deer sized game as well.
BIG OR SMALL I LIKE THEM ALL, 577 TO 22 HORNET.
A BP load is hotter than my old hunting load. I'm working on a new SP hunting load for my Ruger but it's not much hotter than a BP load. I've toyed with the idea of a BP hunting load myself, have no doubt it will do the job.
Life Member NRA, TSRA
Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call Lonesome Dove
Some of my favorite recipes start out with a handful of used wheelweights.
Boolit Mold Join DateDec 2012Posts1537 grains of KIK 3f under a 250 grain bullet is plenty for deer. A rancher friend of mine in Wyoming shot a rank Angus bull between the eyes with his 45LC using the same load and dropped the bull on the spot from a distance of six yards. The meat processor called and wanted to know what the bull had been shot with. He found the bullet in the neck just in front of the shoulders. That load has more horsepower than you might think.
Boolit Mold Join DateFeb 2013Posts4That's great information, I got so tired of the you need a hand cannon to hunt deer story that I began to wonder how we ever survived the old days. When I started to research BP loading I found that all the years of not using my SAA's (they just feel better and I shoot better with them) may have been a waste. As a long time smokeless loader filling the case and squashing the powder seemed counterintuitive. I cant wait to get to the range to test them out, I plan to start them in the BH and move through the SAA repro's and see what happens.You may not post new threadsYou may not post repliesYou may not post attachmentsYou may not edit your postsForum Rules
Abbreviations used in Reloading
Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt"
I don't know how long it will take, but eventually people will find out we aren't BSing them that the patched round ball is the projectile for traditional muzzle loaders...
Let's hold off on the part about using good ol' holy black, they won't believe that either. I upgraded my .45 Hawken to a Green Mountain .54 with a 1-66 twist. May have something to do with it. I have a Lee six-banger mould that will make a year's supply of RB's in no time.
All kidding aside the in-line rifles are probably a bit to fast in twist for RB's.
Life Member NRA, TSRA
Smokeless powder is a passing fad! -Steve Garbe
I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. -Woodrow F. Call Lonesome Dove
Some of my favorite recipes start out with a handful of used wheelweights.
Boolit Master Join DateDec 2009LocationQuilcene, WashingtonPosts907I have always used my own cast boolits for my muzzleloaders. For deer I prefer patched round ball and for elk I prefer a 265 gr .429 boolit with sabot in my 50 cal. believe it or not, I prefer PRB for deer unless I am expecting shots over 150 yards because the sabotted semi wadcutters had too much penetration (little hole in, little hole out) so the deer didn't go down so quickly as with PRB unless I hit a major bone.You may not post new threadsYou may not post repliesYou may not post attachmentsYou may not edit your postsForum Rules
Abbreviations used in Reloading
Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt"
Boolit Bub Join DateMar 2012Locationidaho falls idahoPosts42
My 320grn cast from w.w. ,water dropped lubed with lbt blue lube bullets on top of 21.5 grns of 296 are very accurate and are about all i want to shot in a tense situation.That being time off target from recoil to back on target. this load i have used in confrontations with various and sundry bears you get pass throughs,bullets are big enough to cause nasty wound channels and result in a dead bear! all the talk and speculation dont meam spit ,results speak the loudest. im confident in my vload and that means every thing.
Boolit Master Join DateDec 2009LocationQuilcene, WashingtonPosts907If you were to do the "wet phone book" terminal ballistic test with your boolit at an mv of 1200 and for good measure put a 1/4 piece of plywood 1" inside the front to simulate clipping a bone, I suspect you will get at least 16" of penetration at 40 yards. With that evidence in hand you can be assured your boolit will handily take down anything on this continent out to 75 yards and deer twice that far or more if your eyes are better than mine.
Boolit Buddy Join DateFeb 2013Posts58I suppose the thing that bothers me most is when a guy says he gets 1400 to 1500 fps and thinks it is better. First you need a softer boolit and second you lose accuracyAm I understanding correctly: SOFTER bullets are better for higher velocity loads? I had thought it was the other way around.
Am I understanding correctly: SOFTER bullets are better for higher velocity loads? I had thought it was the other way around.When speaking of handguns, all of them are low velocity. They have very low demands on hardness, when everything is done correctly. I can not think of any standard handgun that would need a hardness of more than 12 Bn.
The solid soft lead bullet is undoubtably the best and most satisfactory expanding bullet that has ever been designed. It invariably mushrooms perfectly, and never breaks up. With the metal base that is essential for velocities of 2000 f.s. and upwards to protect the naked base, these metal-based soft lead bullets are splendid.
John Taylor - "African Rifles and Cartridges"Forget everything you know about loading jacketed bullets. This is a whole new ball game!
Boolit Buddy Join DateFeb 2013Posts58When speaking of handguns, all of them are low velocity. They have very low demands on hardness, when everything is done correctly. I can not think of any standard handgun that would need a hardness of more than 12 Bn.So COWW cured for two weeks or quenched is a good alloy for most North American hunting situations including deer and Texas pigs?
"A man may not care for golf and still be human, but the man who does not like to see, hunt, photograph, or otherwise outwit birds or animals is hardly normal. He is supercivilized, and I for one do not know how to deal with him."
- Aldo Leopold"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force: Whenever you give up that force, you are inevitably ruined."
- Patrick Henry.
Am I understanding correctly: SOFTER bullets are better for higher velocity loads? I had thought it was the other way around.The GC allows a softer, malleable alloy for better expansion to be used at magnum level velocities with excellent accuracy. The same alloy can not be used with a PB'd cast bullet at the same level of velocity with the same accuracy.....thus PB'd cast bullets used for such are "hard cast" to hold up under the load.Larry Gibson
So COWW cured for two weeks or quenched is a good alloy for most North American hunting situations including deer and Texas pigs?With a GC'd bullet you can add 2% tin to the COWWs and then add 100% lead to that for a 50/50% mix and maintain excellent accuracy up through 1400+ fps. That alloy will give much better expansion and terminal performance on said deer and pigs.....even in Texas.Larry Gibson
I think 44man is referring to temperature.I have some lil gun powder and in my pistol after a cylendar full, it is HOT, way to hot to touch. I'm using middle of the road loads too.
maybe 44man could expound on it for us
Yes HEAT. 12 rounds through a .357 and we could not touch the gun. It is so hot from the lack of deterrent it will erode steel. Even Freedom will drop your warranty if you use it. It could also suffer from pressure spikes. Heat could cause that.
Larry has a point about gas checks. If you use a softer alloy because your velocity and caliber needs it, the GC is also needed. It is because it stops base skid. Nothing else it does---or should I say it does nothing else.
But the .44 does not need anything special, just boolit weight and a hard boolit at the right velocity. Don't fool with a 320 gr at 800 fps or 1500 fps. Neither will shoot good enough to hunt with.
Now my large .500 JRH needs some expansion with the 440 gr boolit at 1350 fps. It is another hole punch. I use a PB so the best thing to do is soften the nose some without losing the hard base. If I softened the whole boolit I would need a GC.
A gas check is the best thing ever when you need it but you can get around spending the money.
Alloy choice is what determines if you need a GC.
Any time you get soft enough to skid rifling, you need the skid stop of the GC but if you get too soft or fast you will exceed what it does. There is one point where a GC will spin on the boolit and still seal, you are at the limit. The soft boolit might have skidded too much already and leaded the bore so a recovered boolit will also show a leaded GC. They were not made to scrape lead. The GC can run over leading.
Am I understanding correctly: SOFTER bullets are better for higher velocity loads? I had thought it was the other way around.Yes and also much slower. There is a sweet spot with the .44 where hard works so good I will not vary from it. Regulate your boolit. You will get to where you NEED a GC.
Adjust for just the right expansion by seeing what your boolit does to an actual animal, not paper.
Velocity is good as long as you have accuracy and a boolit that is just right.
If you were to do the "wet phone book" terminal ballistic test with your boolit at an mv of 1200 and for good measure put a 1/4 piece of plywood 1" inside the front to simulate clipping a bone, I suspect you will get at least 16" of penetration at 40 yards. With that evidence in hand you can be assured your boolit will handily take down anything on this continent out to 75 yards and deer twice that far or more if your eyes are better than mine.All testing with all kinds of stuff to shoot really proves nothing. The animal is not made from wood or paper. There is more air in lungs with liquid dispersed through them.
My 330 gr .44 will go through 34" of wet phone books but that shows nothing about energy placed in the lungs. Darn sure, you need energy placed, not before or after the deer.
I suppose the hardest thing is about what a cast boolit can do or not do. You have weight and velocity and you have distance with velocity changes. Now add animal size and toughness. Now different calibers. Add in boolit hardness and you have a huge mess to figure out.You may not post new threadsYou may not post repliesYou may not post attachmentsYou may not edit your postsForum Rules
No easy way out, no fixed answers.
Not like the old days with a pure round ball and BP, just make the ball bigger.
Abbreviations used in Reloading
Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt"
Boolit Master Join DateJan 2012LocationSaskatchewan CanadaPosts242
If a m1 garand is a battle rifle if you dont go in battle , then a sks can be a hog rifle if you ain't shot no hogsHa Ha exactly! It's the intent. I call mine a "deer rifle" even though I have not yet shown it a deer. Maybe this year.
Both my AK's are .3085" ... I size to .311
ShawnJohn 3: 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
"I am a man of peace, but if war comes to my door it will find me home."
Winston Churchill
badbob, the nose of that bullet doesn't look like it hit something sharp like the chamber edge. It looks like it hit inside the chamber rear section hard and at an angle.PS: I've got a hog-huntin', fish-catchin' camping trip coming in a few days, for a few days, and due to truthful criticism, I must admit, I'm taking my SKS instead of the Contender I had planned to take. Headed out in the morning for a scoutin', firewood draggin'-up expedition.
Last edited by Junior1942; 04-05-2013 at 02:48 PM.
Perhaps the Yugo is in some way unique compared to other SKS variants? Perhaps the type of magazine makes a difference? Perhaps your load cycles the action at a different speed than the ammo that I tried?I have noticed that the Yugo guns often need a little more powder to get them to cycle compared to other guns. Also, I noticed that the surplus Yugo ammo seemed a tad on the warm side.
Something must be different somewhere. I'm just not sure what it is yet.
Nice write ups by the way Junior.
?an armed society is a polite society.?
Robert A. Heinlein"Idque apud imperitos humanitas vocabatur, cum pars servitutis esset."
Publius Tacitus
ps ny bushboy If a m1 garand is a battle rifle if you dont go in battle , then a sks can be a hog rifle if you ain't shot no hogsThe majority of M1s in existence have been carried into battle. They were also designed specifically for use as a battle rifle. The majority of SKS rifles have not been fired at hogs to the best of my knowledge. Not calling a M1 a battle rifle is just plain silly in my opinion. Calling a SKS a hog rifle leaves more room for debate, but once it's been carried while looking for hogs, it has earned the label far as I'm concerned.
Last edited by JIMinPHX; 04-05-2013 at 06:14 PM.
?an armed society is a polite society.?
Robert A. Heinlein"Idque apud imperitos humanitas vocabatur, cum pars servitutis esset."
Publius Tacitus
I took a close look at my SKS chamber entrance and compared it to badbob's photo. There's two differences: (1) the little ledge/shelf below the entrance is closer to the entrance on mine; and (2) my entrance edge is distinctly chamfered on the bottom half of the entrance.
i also enjoyed your article '' the metplats tale '' great article thanks junior you should write a book , i would purchase it .. ps hope you may christen your yugo with a nice porker , i found out the original 311041 by lyman is .227 on the metplat the Noe is 180 a big difference in feeding , so i will shoot the Noe to report its flight and accuracy , i thought there was a larger dent in the metplat now i know why ... best wishes on the hunt , and write me a book ... your articles are exellent
http://www.castbullet.com/reload/meplat.htm
I have a little Charles Daly Mini Mauser on 7.62x39. Haven't tried it with heavier bullets, but I like the 31141. Now I need to test it in that rifle.Can someone give me a good starting load for that?
I am alsodoing a small ring mouser that Steve Bowers from our board built for my 9 year old Ithas a 308 barrel and i will need to start loading for this one to so any advice is good advice.Jaime
I have a little Charles Daly Mini Mauser on 7.62x39. Haven't tried it with heavier bullets, but I like the 31141. Now I need to test it in that rifle.Can someone give me a good starting load for that?
Start at 14.5 gr 4227 IMR, and work your way up
15 gr 4227imr great load drops brass 1-2 feet from my rifle works action 99% of the time if not all ..never had a failure but was a little too close for comfort .i would like it to throw brass a little further so i wont exp a stovepipe jamb ..
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?13453-Practical-Dope-on-the-7-62X39/page6
I took a close look at my SKS chamber entrance and compared it to badbob's photo. There's two differences: (1) the little ledge/shelf below the entrance is closer to the entrance on mine; and (2) my entrance edge is distinctly chamfered on the bottom half of the entrance.can you get a picture ? thanks bob
can you get a picture ? thanks bobI'll try.
Lee C309-150F (160gr) is my boolit of choice in my CZ-527. I have shot 311041 and Saeco #315 and they group well, but the Lee gives me better groups, higher velocity, and less recoil in this flyweight bolt action.M4 is AR platform?
That Lee bullet shoots well out of my CZ527,too, I think my bore slugged .310 if I remember correctly. Lee bullet shot well enough in that little rifle that i didn't do much load development.
Cast Boolits, Where lead balloons go over....
UGH! Now yet more of my $$$ is heading to Slovenia. Oh well, at least I'm not wasting good money on dumb stuff like food or electricity..
I'll be a nice to you as you'll let me be, or as mean as you make me be.Polite society started dying the day it was no longer necessary for rude men to physically defend themselves from the consquences of their actions or words.
that ought to hit em hard , nice looking boolit
?an armed society is a polite society.?You may not post new threadsYou may not post repliesYou may not post attachmentsYou may not edit your postsForum Rules
Robert A. Heinlein"Idque apud imperitos humanitas vocabatur, cum pars servitutis esset."
Publius Tacitus
Abbreviations used in Reloading
Pointed Soft Point "Core Lokt"
