Currious about gas checks

Boolit Buddy Join DateJan 2013LocationRapid City, SDPosts71

I've never used gas checks, but would consider them in a rifle if I ever decide to cast for one. I'd like to know how they are put on. Are they pushed on by finger, crimped on, and is there a special machine for them. I also wondered if they come off when the bullet is in flight?

Lyman's Cast Bullet Handbooks (3rd & 4th editions) give an excellent explanation to your questions.

Simple answers are; Are they pushed on by finger (initially but a "seater" is sometimes also used), crimped on(yes if they are the crimp on type, there are commercial and home made non crimp ons also), and is there a special machine for them (yes, either a lubrasizer with sizing dies or a push through sizer will crimp them on.. I also wondered if they come off when the bullet is in flight? (crimp ons should not come off in flight and slip ons many times don't either.

Larry Gibson

Boolit Man Join DateNov 2011Posts114

I've never used gas checks, but would consider them in a rifle if I ever decide to cast for one. I'd like to know how they are put on. Are they pushed on by finger, crimped on, and is there a special machine for them. I also wondered if they come off when the bullet is in flight?First off, you need to use a cast bullet that is designed to take a gas check. Check out Lee Precision for their range of bullet moulds for example.
The simplest and cheapest way to seat a gas check is with a Lee bullet sizing die of the appropriate size or, if you wish to use them unsized as cast, I have found the ideal way is fix them to the base of the bullet with Lok-Tite before I lube the bullets with Lee liquid Alox.
ukrifleman.

Not that many years ago, there were no significant tools for seating gas checks, but most folks lubed with a Lyman 45 or equivalent. I've never heard of gas checks coming off myself, but I suppose it's probably happened. Not exactly a common thing.

Folks used to be led to believe a gas check reduced leading, but that's been debunked many times. It does seem they do protect the base of the boolit from powder combustion gases. I am of the opinion they aren't needed until your velocity gets up near the 2000 fps or over range.

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Installing gas checks?

Boolit Mold Join DateNov 2012Posts8

I posted in the molds forum asking for recommendations for a mold for my new 357 maximum. I received many good suggestions. So on to the next problem. I don't have a single stage press. I use a hornady lnl progressive. And unles I'm mistaken, Im going to need to run the boolits through a sizing die to attach the gas check, and I can't do so on my progressive. So what's the most cost effective way to be able to do this? I don't want to dish out the dough for a high end single stage. I was wondering if it would be possible size/install checks with a lee hand press? I know that would be pushing it but it's definitely cheap. Just looking for a way to get into boolits without needing a whole new press. Thanks guys!

I have been using one of these http://leeprecision.com/reloader-press.html for doing what you describe. At one time there was an offer that combined this press and the Lee reloading book as a combo for a low price and it may still be available. Even though I use Star lube sizers this press is still used to seat and crimp the GC's prior to the lubing.

I use a Lee reloader press just for de priming and for making my gas checks. They are good for lots of things, I knew a guy who took the handle off and used it to hold his powder measure.

"Silence in the face of tyranny implies consent, and I do not consent." Mike Vanderbough, April 20, 2013

Since about 1970, I've just set one in the die, put the boolit in it and worked the handle of my Lyman 450. Countless operations later I've had few problems. None with Hornady crimp-ons I can remember; occasionally I have a Lyman GC fall off the boolit base. I just stick it back in place and move on.

"Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach a man to fish and you feed him for a lifetime.", old Chinese proverb.

I have used the Lee push-through sizer on 500 S&W. That did not get checks fully seated, so they were often not square. The Hornady checks were real snug. I now seat the checks by hand using a piece of marble and a light nylon faced hammer. Then I use the Lee sizing die. If I ever load these in volume, I will get a Lyman or RCBS lubrisizer. I have a SAECO lubesizer, but it does don't go as big as 50 cal.

Honestly, how do you seat gas checks in a reloading press? I do it, but I had to make custom dies. There are no commercial reloading press dies that do it correctly. Most specifically including the Lee pushthrough, which cannot get them square, as Iron Mike pointed out. My home-made die presses the (Hornady exclusively!) checks on dead square, and from there the boolit gets transferred to the Lyman 4500 for crimping and lubing. You need a proper lube-sizer anyway, why waste money on a cheap Lee hand press (having dubious accuracy and dubious longevity) that could be going toward a proper piece of equipment. Buy cheap, buy twice.

"You are not a hoarder until you have exceeded a lifetime supply"

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Soda can gas checks

Soda cans are able to used though it depends on two factors. The gauge of the side wall of the can and the final thickness of the check itself.

Our cans are only 4 thou so two layers is OK for .22 but not much else. The more layers you have the more difficult it is to form a nice check. Prior to getting 16 thou material from Yonky I used to ply a piece of 12 thou litho plate with a layer of soda can and make 16 thou checks that are brilliant.

Cheers from New Zealand

Jeff.

Ummmmmm, I don't think that's "soda"..............

I think the "soda" can checks are intended for PB bullets. Thin metal will not work on a bullet with a GC heel.

Don Verna

It works on a gas check bullet if you double and triple, but as Jeff said, it dont work great.
They do work on plain base boolits very well though.

Ummmmmm, I don't think that's "soda"..............I think you are right. Looks to be a Budweiser can. One of my favorite soda for sure.
but back to the topic, I find that Mountain Dew cans work very well and Guinness beer cans also make very good checks. Never mic'ed either, but found they work very well. Make nice checks for my 35 PB with a Pat Marlin maker.

Those soda cans are starting to get pretty thin. When you can't hold a full can without squeezing soda out the opening..........it's too thin...................

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Wax Gas Checks vs Dental Wax sheets..

Some of the ol' timers might remember the wax gas checks that were sold quite a few years ago, I think the guy who made and sold those is still around but hard to get in contact with these days.

Anyhow, I am wondering what he used in his gas check material that made it special or different from plain old dental wax?

I had some 340gr SSK boolits loaded over 22gr of WW296, these loads were put up in 1995 or thereabouts, and I had forgotten about using the wax gas checks, and I shot them and noticed this red ring of waxy stuff on the case mouth and I thought wtf is that? Wasn't until a few weeks later that I realized those had been loaded with the wax gas check sheets. They still shot well, were accurate, and you could clean the barrel with not much more than a wadded up paper towel.

Maybe it was a passing fad back then, and maybe they didn't work quite as well as the maker claimed but I had fairly good luck with them when I started using them and would like to try them again. It's likely they didn't hurt anything, and could serve to "season" the bore somewhat between shots. I have some .060" dental wax sheets that I will probably use but I am wondering what the dental wax might be missing.

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22 caliber Hornady gas checks in stock at Midway

Boolit Buddy Join DateSep 2011Posts64

Greetings shooters,

I've been trying for several months to find some 22 cal gas checks to experiment with some reloads for my AR. Every place I've tried has been out of stock. Yesterday I was cruising the MidwayUsa site and they had Hornady 22 gas checks in stock. I ordered a thousand this morning. If anyone else needs the 22 caliber gas checks you can order them now.

best wishes- oldandslow

Thanks, oldandslow! I just ordered some.

Boolit Bub Join DateMar 2013LocationBoise, Id.Posts23

Thanks, I will check this out.

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Gas checks

There's an entire subforum that gives you the yes answer to your question.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/foru...?60-Gas-Checks

Lots of old threads about check makers and materials.

mike

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Seating Gas Checks with Lee Sizer

I've seen that some don't lube the bullets before seating gas checks with the push through sizer. The directions say to lube with Alox, and then size/seat gas check.

Is one method preferable? I'd rather not lead up my sizer if I don't have to, but I can see gas checks seating better on unlubed bullets.

Boolit Buddy Join DateApr 2009LocationHouston TXPosts59

I use a little of the Imperial sizing wax before pushing thru the Lee sizer.

I use the Imperial sizing wax on plain cast bullets and powder coated bullets.

Installing the gas checks works best if the Lee sizer is inverted and a hand press is used to push the check and bullet thru the press.

The common press is the 1/2 ton press from Harbor Freight.

If you are using a flat nose design just flip the boolit over and push it through that way. If your mold is tossing them fairly well and they clip right on try dipping them in LLA and letting them dry. Then size.
A set of these makes dipping pretty easy no matter what design: http://shop.hobbylobby.com/products/stainless-steel-jewelry-tweezers-111724/

GSSF RSO
NRA RSO
DU

"People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf."
George Orwell

These are the times that try men's souls.
Thomas Payne

It doesn't take much lube to go through the sizing die.
I use a rag with a little olive oil drizzled over it, pile a bunch of bullets on the rag and wrap them up and give them a bit of a rub.

I use the beer can gas checks and they don't handle the cookie cutter to well when I pan lube and the cookie cutter won't work on unsized bullits so after I drizzle and size I pan lube, then shove them back through the sizer butt first to seat the check.
Yeah, I know it's tedious, but it works.

Hard work made me what I am today,
Broken and broke
******************************
Bob

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Lyman vs Hornady checks question

Boolit Master Join DateDec 2009LocationQuilcene, WashingtonPosts885

In the past I have always used Hornady crimp-on checks and put them on through my Lee sizers. No problems. Today I got a "screaming-run-like-a-thief" deal on 22 cal Lyman checks at a local gun show. Will these checks go on the same way if I tumble lube the boolits with Alox before I put on the checks then size since I assume they are not a crimp-on like the Hornady? Are there any special tricks to using the Lymans? I got a great deal on some 25 cal checks at the same time.

Well back to my original question, Is Hornady making Lyman checks? I read it some where (An older Handloader I cant seem to locate) I know the plastic bag of copper checks that comes out of each companies box looks identical, as do their respective copper checks, however I know Lyman used to sell brass colored checks.
I would think its going to be if they are copper, they are similar enough, if they arent well it will be trial an error.
Pete

Lyman used to sell brass colored checks that were not the crimp on type that were not made by Hornady. The new Lyman checks are copper, are the crimp on type and are made by Hornady

Boolit Master Join DateDec 2009LocationQuilcene, WashingtonPosts885

These are definitely brass checks. They are in Ideal boxes. Got close to 3,000 for $1 (yes, one dollar so now you know why I felt like running like a thief). Even if I have to super glue them on before lubing and sizing, it might be worth the effort if anyone can tell me if they require any special treatment.

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Alum. gas checks on eBay.

Boolit Mold Join DateMar 2013Posts13

I've been casting for years for my 45 auto. Just now getting into casting for my rifles. Never had to use gas checks before and its foreign to me. I would rather use copper gas checks but have found some cheap aluminum ones on eBay. Is there anything wrong with these and is there anything I should be looking out for?

Yes there is plenty wrong with them. They're bowls with a rounded bottom. They aren't flat with a sharp bottom edge. When you seat them, the base of your bullet is rounded like you'd get from an incomplete pour on a cast bullet. Of course, this is just my experience and others might have had better luck. My first experience with the aluminum checks were positive until i bought 22 checks. They were partially formed, ragged edged, and bowl like

Boolit Man Join DateAug 2010LocationJacksonville, AlPosts107

I sell aluminum , Gator copper checks gas checks on EBay and my website. I personally shoot aluminum gas checks. I have sold millions of aluminum checks and have many repeat customers world wide. I can fit bullet molds that are almost a hundred years old. I have also failed to fit molds with shanks that are thousandths of inch to small requiring special tools and forty thousandths material. Are they accurate, clean shooting and cheaper ? Yes

Boolit Man Join DateAug 2010LocationJacksonville, AlPosts107

FLHTC, if you bought 22 aluminum checks from me. I would be glad to refund your money or replace your checks. James

I have bought yours without an issue but it seems many are jumping on the band wagon today and with questionable quality. Thanks for standing behind your product. Something i wish more ebay sellers would do.

Boolit Mold Join DateMar 2013Posts13

Thanks for the info. My wife just ordered me 1000.

Sagebrush, How do I find you on Ebay?

"A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than a gun in the hands of 200 million law-abiding citizens."

Why pay ebay price? If it is 30's 35's or 45's you are looking for I got that covered at a cheaper price than ebay.

I started buying the aluminum gc from sagebrush7 on ebay and had good luck with them. I discovered he has a website and i buy there direct now. Google "Sage's Outdoors".

I'm using Sage's checks on .30, .32-40, 38-55, .375, 9.3mm, and .45 rifle boolits; and 357 pistol boolits. The .375 rifle checks are the only ones that I could get to work properly on boolits made in the NOE 9.3mm 280 gr mold.

I'm very happy with the checks and the service.

Last edited by jethunter; Today at 06:43 PM.

I was gifted some of sageoutdoors .30 checks. They crimp well onto the Lee 309-150-FP and Lee 309-170-FP. They stay on to the target - I have a bullet trap for recycling my alloy and the checks are all in there with the projectiles. I have not actually tried any other checks so can't compare as yet. Lyman copper .30 GC are $AUD73 per thousand in Australia:
http://www.qldgunexchange.com/QGEWeb/product.seam?productId=121140

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223 gas checks made from used large rifle primers?

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9.3 specific checks work great

Boolit Master Join DateOct 2007Posts164

ordered some 9.3 specific gas checks a few months ago, finally cast some boolits and was impressed with the new checks. Unlike the 375 checks which are commonly used, no more concave or convex checks. perfect.

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Trade me some 50 cal PB gas checks?

Morning all,

I'm getting ready to order a 50PB from Pat. Would like to experiment with a few hundred first.

Anybody have a 50 PB CheckMaker and interested in trading some checks ? I have 40 and 45 PB pop can checks. Also be happy to trade some cast boolits if wanted. I have quite an assortment of 45 pistol moulds along with assorted 357, 500, 41.

Thanks

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gator checks

are getting back in stock!

check frequently as I'm updating as they arrive.

Thanks Blammer , just placed an order for couple thou of the 308.
digger

Blammer Im having problems getting into the group buy login. i had it set up for my login. Who do i need to talk to for help?

wiljen is the man for help on the GB login.

Hopefully, some 8mm checks will be with the new arrivals.

It most be some sort of check to fit a 'gator!!!

Cheers from New Zealand

Jeff.

Blammer, do you have any 22 cal. checks?

"A pen in the hand of this president is far more dangerous than a gun in the hands of 200 million law-abiding citizens."

Boolit Mold Join DateMar 2013Posts10

Blammer I too am having difficulty with the login.

How do I PM wiljen

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Annealing copper checks?

Hello all,
I have a couple of questions I know have been addressed here before, probably many times, but I cant seem to find it.
I'm having a couple of issues with copper checks and thinking that annealing them might help. My first issue is that after installing the checks and sizing and lubing my checks are larger in diameter than my sized and lubed bullets. I'm thinking this is probably due to the "spring back" of the copper material. The other issue is that on one of my 30cal molds the check to shank fit is very snug, and I find myself tapping the base of the bullet on my benchtop trying to get the check installed square to the bullet base. This bullet design has a tapered gas check shank.
I'm thinking that I could probably anneal the checks in my toaster oven which I use to heat treat bullets. If so, at what temperature and time should I use, and should I water quench afterwards or air cool them?
Your responses or pointing me in the right direction with previous threads is much appreciated.
Thanks,
Rick

Yep use your toaster oven to anneal, set the temp 450-500? spread the checks in an old cookie sheet heat for 45 minutes
then air cool they'll be soft and have little if any springback.
Washing the checks first to remove any manufactering lube helps to reduce carbon buildup on the heated checks.

Calamity Jake

NRA Life Member
SASS 15704
Shoot straight, keepem in the ten ring.

Thanks for your help. I'll give it a try.

I don't think 450-500? is enough to anneal, I think you will need closer to 600? for about an hour.

I have a small cast iron skillet that I use to anneal check. Dump the checks in and put on the stove top. Stir them around every once in a while, until they are all nice and black. Let them cool and that is that. It is worth the effort.

Disclaimer: The above is not holy writ. It is just my opinion based on my experience and knowledge. Your mileage may vary.

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PB 9mm checks

Boolit Man Join DateMar 2009Locationeastern IowaPosts141

I make 9mm PB gas checks. Mine are a shallow cup.I know some of you make 9mm pb checks with a deep cup . Mine are with the typical pop can/beer can aluminum. I have shot these out of a 9mm pistol and 38 revolver with good results. Good accuracy and no leading. I would like to propose a trade of 9mm gas checks. I would like to try the deeper cupped checks. Maybe some or you would like to try a more shallow cup check. I make mine both ways paint in and paint out. It does not seem to matter which way they are made. Mine size on in the accepted way of the thin gas check. Backwards through a push through sizer or a in and out sizer like a lyman 450. I can put up for trade from 50 to a 1000,whatever anybody likes. I have made many of these.
n.h.schmidt

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Best place to buy gas checks?

I am making them in about 2 weeks and will be a vendor here by Tues/Wed if ya can wait, I need a test pilot for em also anr would be able to send 100 at no cost.

Joshua

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